How FP&A Expertise Paves the Way for Becoming a Chief of Staff

Written By Ankita Ghosh

Show Notes

Welcome to FP&A Tomorrow, where we discuss financial planning and analysis, examining its current state and future prospects, with your host Paul Barnhurst. 

The title sponsor for this week’s episode of FP&A Tomorrow is the Third Generation FP&A Tools Showcase. Join the Showcase and see the latest technology in FP&A planning software. Register for free today at https://www.accelevents.com/e/fpatoolsshowcase

In today’s episode, Paul engages in an insightful interaction with Trevor Anthony, for a fascinating discussion on the evolution of financial planning and analysis (FP&A) and how artificial intelligence (AI) is shaping its future.

Trevor, a seasoned Chief of Staff at FranConnect, excels in transforming FP&A roles into powerful business partnerships that drive organizational success. With a rich background in private equity-backed software companies, Trevor is known for his expertise in creating simple and impactful financial models, he simplifies complex financial data into actionable intelligence.


Key takeaways from this week's episode include: :

Here is a concise summary of the key points from the discussion:

  • How AI could significantly reduce costs and streamline operational processes, positioning FP&A to be more efficient and strategically integral to businesses.

  • The importance of mastering the skill of creating clean and straightforward financial models for FP&A professionals. By prioritizing simplicity and clarity, these models become crucial tools for delivering precise financial data for business insights.

  • The value of experience, mentorship, and strategic thinking in the evolution of FP&A professionals. It stresses how these elements help transition from traditional analytical roles to more influential positions.

  • How private equity (PE) impacts FP&A operations, setting high expectations for teams to act as the definitive source of truth within companies.

  • The discussion highlights how PE firms demand thorough, detailed financial reporting and forecasts, reflecting their reliance on FP&A teams to provide thorough insights and accurate analysis to guide investment decisions and business strategies.

  • The discussion also highlights the anticipation of a future where AI not only supports but enhances the FP&A functions across various industries.

Quotes:

Here are a few relevant quotes from the episode about the strategic thinking around technology investment, the value of networking, the importance of responsiveness in professional settings, and the encouragement for community engagement:


"The best FP&A groups, I've seen, have solidified themselves as a mission-critical function, not just to check the box type of group."

"First and foremost, keep it simple. I think in the sales process, they demo flashy things... focus on what the tool does."

"The beginning of what I'd call a business partnering relationship was when I'd sit down with the business owner and have to intimately understand their business and their financials."

“Dealing with ambiguity, especially when you're working with senior leaders, they constantly vaguely describe things. You, as a professional, need to understand what that means.”


“If you're like a traditional corporate FP&A person or you're just a data analyst, find those opportunities."

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For CPE credit please go to earmarkcpe.com, listen to the episode, download the app, and answer a few questions. For AFP FPAC certification answer the questions and contact Paul Barnhurst for further details.


In today's episode:

[01:00] Introduction.

[02:00] Guest’s background.

[03:12] AI's Impact on FP&A and the essential technical skill for FP&A professionals.

[04:55] Guest’s Career Transition to Chief of Staff.

[05:20] Introduction to 3rd Generation FP&A Tools Showcase.

[11:30] Strategic Role of FP&A.

[17:11] Advice for Aspiring Chiefs of Staff.

[21:01] Lessons learned from implementing FP&A tools.

[26:13] Expectations from FP&A teams by private equity companies.

[34:10] Rapid-fire session.

[37:32] Community Engagement.

[38:30] Upcoming Event Promotion.

[39:50] Guest’s Personal Insights.


Full Show Transcript:  

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: Hello everyone. Welcome to FP&A tomorrow, where we delve into the world of financial planning and analysis, examining its current state and future prospects. I'm your host, Paul Barnhurst, aka the FP&A Guy, and I'll be guiding you through the evolving landscape of FP&A. Each week, we'll be joined by thought leaders, industry experts, and practitioners who share their insights and experiences, helping us navigate today's complexities and tomorrow's uncertainties. Whether you're a seasoned professional or just starting your journey in FP&A, this show has something for everyone. This week, I'm thrilled to welcome to the show Trevor Anthony. Trevor, welcome to the show.

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: Thanks, Paul. Excited to be here.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: Excited to have you. So let me just give it a little bit about Trevor's background. In a few minutes here, we'll give him the opportunity to tell us more. But he comes to us from Lehi, Utah, so he's up in the Silicon Slopes area. He's currently serving as chief of staff at FranConnect. He earned his bachelor's in finance from Brigham Young University, my alma mater. He spent the majority of his career so far in private equity-backed software companies. So, Trevor, the first question I'm going to ask you here is, what does great FP&A look like in the world today? What do you see as great FP&A?

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: It's a good question. The best FP&A groups, I've seen, have solidified themselves as a mission-critical function, not just to check the box type of group. They're easy to work with. They're not roadblockers, but they're enablers. They're responsive and predictable. They deliver things on time, that kind of stuff.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: I like the two things you said there. One is mission critical and two is they're enablers, not roadblockers. They're not CFNo, as we've all heard. Those are good answers. So I'm curious, how do you see FP&A changing over the next few years with AI and technology moving so rapidly? Do you see it being different five years from now?

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: I do, and I hope so. Maybe both of those. I've always said when I've led my teens or even in my own role, I want to automate myself out of a job. What that means is, you become more of a strategic partner. I believe in that business partnering relationship with FP&A or with your executives in the FP&A world. But what I would love to see is AI tools, because today you have FP&A organizations, they are small. So it's sometimes hard to get the budget to invest in the biggest, greatest technologies. I can see a future with AI where it helps lower the cost or maybe even streamline the implementation process. Before, it took 300 hours to implement a tool and now with AI, it may, significantly, be lower. But I'm a believer of investing in technology. I think every finance group should invest in technology. It's just sometimes they don't. It's cost-prohibitive. Maybe that's where AI can help.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: Let's hope so. I know that finance is often the last department to invest in itself because they're looking at it and saying, "Hey, I can get bigger returns elsewhere." often as being the stewards of the capital. So it's a challenge. If that cost can come down, it makes it easier to invest. So let's hope, AI does drive continued automation and improvement in finance because today we all spend too much time manipulating data.

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: For sure. For sure.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: Why don't you tell our audience about yourself a little bit about your background and what you're doing today?

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: I started my career at a small mergers and acquisitions advisory group. Our primary clients were often private equity groups. So we're introducing private equity groups to privately held businesses or we'd get to know a business owner and we'd introduce them to a private equity group or a strategic buyer. Did that for about five years, and then I transitioned from that into your traditional FP&A roles. As you mentioned earlier, most of it has been at private equity-backed software companies or venture-backed tech companies where I've led the FP&A team. I've been an FP&A business partner. Then somehow along the lines, we'll go into more details, I got this chief of staff role. I'm on my second stint as the chief of staff at a company that's headquartered in Washington, D.C. But I'm remote here, in Utah, so I travel out there. But I'm the chief of staff at a software, private equity-backed company.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: Great. That's one of the things that I thought was interesting to have you on as a guest. It is kind of talking a little bit about how that came about, maybe how FP&A prepared you for it. We'll dive into that more as we get into the interview. But first, I want to ask you a question. You mentioned you started your career in M&A, dealing with both buy and sell-side transactions. How did that help prepare you for an FP&A role? What did you take with you from that experience when you went into your first FP&A role?

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: A couple of things. First and foremost part of that role was I would sit down with the business owner and have to intimately understand their business and their financials, not just the financials, but financials is a key part of it. I'd have to anticipate the questions I think a private equity buyer might ask them. Then be prepared to address it. So that almost was like the beginning of what I'd call a business partnering relationship. Then on the flip side, I got to know the private equity world well. I got to know what they're looking for, how they value businesses, what makes a business valuable to them, and why would they invest. Then they come up with a thesis about how they grow a business and how they make it profitable. The other thing that I got involved in is these business owners had, I'd say, less sophisticated ways of managing their business. So they'd send over like a PDF of their financial statements, and I'd just get very messy financial data and I'd have to make sense of it. I'd have to put it together, clean it up, and present it back to the business owner or the private equity group. I found it was such a natural transition to go into FP&A because that's what you're doing in FP&A, you take something that's messy and ugly and you make it look nice.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: There is a lot of truth to that. You're trying to pull all that data together and find some insight or derive some value from something. When you start, it's often a complete mess, for lack of a better word. So I like that. I can see where that helped prepare you for FP&A. I'm curious, you did FP&A for quite a while and then you ended up as the chief of staff and this is your second time being chief of staff. So first, how did that come about? How did you end up becoming a chief of staff? Why did you pick that role when you had been in FP&A? So maybe a little bit of that backstory.

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: It's kind of an interesting story but at one of the companies where I was the business partner for an executive that I worked underneath that executive, I would say, like a mini CFO or even a mini chief of staff then. I was with him for about four years, and then a few years later, he left that company and became the CEO of another software company. He and I just regularly would catch up, we'd go to lunch or whatever. I was telling him how I had left that prior company. I was leading the FP&A team in another tech company. I was talking about all the things I implemented, the software tools we implemented, the processes we created, and he just said, "Hey, I want you to be my chief of staff." It makes it a long story, in short, I was like, "No, that makes no sense. I don't know what a chief of staff is. Is that like an admin role?" Then he had me interviewed with board members and I'm like, oh, wow, this is a big deal. I could interact with the board of directors. I could get in the trenches with our private equity owners and I took it and that's how I got into it. It was a fun, awesome experience for me.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: What was your kind of favorite part of that role of chief of Staff? what did you like about it once you got into it and realized it wasn't just an admin role?

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: There are so many projects that a CEO can't necessarily lead or be involved in. But they're important. That's often what I've done where they say, as an example, we wanted to better understand a segment in our industry if we should invest more in it, make more hires, hire more salespeople, what does the industry looks like? What does the TAM look like? What's the market size, and what's our current penetration of that? I did a full PNL analysis and presented that back to our CEO or even broader, our board of directors on what we believe we should do to go after that market. We didn't have someone who could just naturally lead that. That's what I did, and I did a lot of those things. Also, I've always gotten involved in M&A. I've led the corporate development side and that's a ton of fun, looking at prospective companies to acquire. That was a big part of my role in my last company. Then also we did sell the company. I was intimately a part of that process, which was a ton of fun, also.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: Great. It sounds like you've done a lot of different things in the chief of staff role. You're kind of wearing a lot of different hats and helping be an extension of the CEO on different projects and strategic initiatives to analyze those, make recommendations, and see if they make sense.

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: Well, yes. That's right.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: Sounds like a great role. How did FP&A prepare you for that role?

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: Because of my role as what I define as a true business partner. FP&A role it was very natural. I was already acting a lot in that. I think that a big difference, though, is in FP&A, my role was very focused on the analysis, the numbers, the forecasting, the budget, and the year-over-year trends. But then the chief of staff elevates that beyond just the tactical numbers. It's the strategic side. How do we create a plan and execute it? That is very different than your traditional business partnering relationship. Which shouldn't be I think a great business partner in FP&A is very strategic. But it's usually around numbers and trends and all that.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: I would agree with that. So it leads me to a question. How do you think we become more strategic in FP&A? I think we're starting to see it myself and become more commercially minded. But how do we get to that next level so that we're not so caught up in the tactical, which is easy to get overwhelmed on the tactical side of FP&A?

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: One of my mentors that I used to report to, he was the VP of finance at a prior company, and I was in this business partnering role, something he said to me over and over that I think has changed my mindset as I interact with executives is, We'd be sitting down and I present our forecast for the next year, and he would use this phrase, he would speak on the CFOs behalf and he'd say, "This is how they might react to what you just showed me." I think about that often when I'm in a role, I need to think higher. I need to think about how might the CEO react to what we're putting together and how might the CFO react. Put your feet in their shoes and put the CEO hat on. I think once you do that, you start to realize some of these tactical things probably aren't very important to them. It's about how you tell a better story about what's going on. It's not just like, hey, we're over budget by 5%, but like, what's going on, or does it even matter if we're over by 5%? What's the bigger story about how we're trending towards the end of the year? What do we need to do today to ride the ship? I think that the strategic mindset is to put the CEO, the owner hat on.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: I think that's great. I love that the owner hat on. Are there any other frameworks or thoughts or maybe ways to go through processes to help you be more strategic that you use?

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: This is not the answer you want. But I, also, think it's experience. Align yourself up with someone who truly has been in these roles for a long time and listen to them, listen to how they react to things, listen to how they manage these things. I think initially when you're in your early career, you're very reactionary, you're very sensitive. You don't understand, you don't know what they're asking. Things are confusing to you. Listen to those more senior people who've done it, who've been in the trenches, you'll learn a ton from them. I think, as you think about that, too, you can learn what questions are they asking, how are they listening, how they react to this question, or how they deal with it. That's how I've learned the most from other people. I rarely just learn something on my own and I'm like, "Ah, I'm genius." No, someone taught me that.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: I think there's so much truth to that. Often I'm training something and everybody is like, how did you learn this? I kind of stole the idea from somebody else. That's where our most good ideas come from other people. Sometimes we come up with a great idea on our own or somebody does. But so much we learn is from observing and watching others, whether that be people you work with, reading, or whatever it may be. I agree with you, especially, at work, having that mentor who's been through the fire, who's had those experiences that you can turn to is invaluable. It's one of the big reasons I've created a community called Plan Buddies, so people can come and talk, and you can learn from other people's experience in FP&A because sometimes you don't have that, especially, if you're in a small company. You don't have that person to go to, or you don't want to go to your boss for the 10th time that day and ask them the question because he's busy.

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: Well, it's common, Paul. It's common that the FP&A groups are small. There are very few that are big. It's just how it is.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: Especially, in smaller companies, private equity, fast-growing, getting a big public company, it's a little different. But I agree with you. FP&A is a very small part, especially, in early-stage companies. Often one person and then the CFO or their VP of finance, it's not like you have ten different salespeople you can go talk to, what should I do in this situation? I agree with you. So if we have someone listening today that's heard you talk about chief of staff, I'm like, that sounds like the perfect role to me. I'd love to get involved more in strategy and do something like that. What advice would you offer them as far as looking to get into a chief of staff role?

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: I think it depends on what your current role is. For example, if you're like a traditional corporate FP&A person or you're just a data analyst, or maybe you're in investor relations, but you haven't done what I call the business partnering side, find those opportunities. I think the business partnering side is probably the best way to do it. Not every FP&A organization does business partnering. Some do it well, but to some, that's not important. But find an organization that does that because that's where you become a mini CEO or even a mini chief of staff to that partner, and you're part of their team. You become like a chief of staff and that's the best way. Other than that, I think any time there's an opportunity to raise your hand to lead a project, let's say, you're at a company that just did an acquisition and they're looking for someone to help with integration, raise your hand, and say, I want to be part of this. Even if you're just on the assigned, but someone else is leading it. You can see how they're leading, integrating, and leading a project. Because as you learn how to do that, it will enable you to be a great chief of staff.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: FP&A Guy, here. I want to personally invite you to the upcoming 3rd generation FP&A Tools Showcase. It is a virtual event you don't want to miss. On May 30th, join FP&A professionals and industry leaders as we delve into the latest innovations transforming financial planning, discover cutting-edge solutions from top providers, and learn through in-depth sessions including company overviews, product demos, and customer success stories. As a CFO or FP&A professional, this showcase is tailored for you. You will be able to get insights from experts such as Glenn Hopper, Waterborne, and myself. Spaces are limited, so go on over to my LinkedIn page and learn more in the featured section, or check out the show notes for the link to register for this event. You will not want to miss the 3rd FP&A Tools Showcase. See you there! I think you gave some great answers there, and I would 100% agree with the business partnering role. There are different types of FP&A. There are corporate roll-up roles where you're just rolling up all the data from finance. You're not dealing with the business partners day to day. Having that business partner role, you're a mini CFO or as you said, a chief of staff. I've had several of those roles and regular conversations and being involved in all those meetings and seeing all those projects helps prepare you. Because if you have a company that trusts finance, that looks at finance to be a seat at the table, you're helping make strategic decisions or providing insights and recommendations. So it's a great way to prepare yourself for something like that. You never know when that business partner becomes the CEO.

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: That's right. My perfect example. That's what happened. He trusted me. He knew me. He went on to do great things and he brought me with him.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: It's usually who we know that gets us a role, not necessarily what we know.

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: For sure. There are a lot of chances.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: Obviously, we need to be competent, but it pays to know people and to build your network, without a doubt. So I'm going to shift gears here a little bit because I know you've implemented several FP&A tools during your career. So I would just like to know what are some of the lessons you've learned from those experiences going through that more than once? What are maybe some of your key takeaways?

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: First and foremost, keep it simple. I think in the sales process, they demo flashy things, and they will show you the coolest stuff. They'll show you charts, they'll show you dashboards and be like, this is going to change your life. Truthfully, a dashboard or a report isn't necessarily the thing that's going to make you great. It's what the tool does. How does it save you time? How does it enable you to replicate yourself over and over? Those kind of things. So I would say, have 1 to 2 important outcomes and focus on that. I know there are plenty of people, who say, wow, we should do all ten of those things, and let's do it now. Some people can handle that. But I promise your implementation and your speed to success will be significantly delayed. I'm always in favor, just get it going, get it in, and get using it. That's the other thing. They'll drag it out for a year. They'll be using their old system. You'll have a spreadsheet and a tool here, and you're using them both at the same time, and it's hard to cut over and you get a value from it immediately. Then you have to commit to using it. You got to get everyone on board. Otherwise, I've seen it time and time again where they invest in a tool and they never got out of the implementation and they never used it.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: I know, as I like to say, they become expensive data repositories and paperweights, so to speak. We've all seen where you just end up going, I'm just going to stay in Excel. So I think you made some great points there of one, you need to understand what's important to you and stick to that so you don't get caught up in the hype of what some sales guy is telling you. That looks great, but isn't important to do your day-to-day work or as important as those other five things you identified before you started. There is the other things, one, the training you have to commit, you have to train the team. Two, don't try to bite the entire apple at once, roll it out in phases, figure out what's most important, and continue to build so that you're not overwhelmed.

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: That's right.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: Well, that's a great advice. Any experience you can share from the different tools you implemented, maybe something that went well or any kind of real horror story that you've had?

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: I think sometimes when you have a way of doing something, maybe in a spreadsheet and you're just held on to it and the person who's doing the implementation, they might suggest, hey, it's kind of business as usual to do it this way. But you might be just convinced you have to do it your way. I think being willing to listen to them, maybe cater to like, hey, it's okay to do it their way, that's probably one lesson. I've seen it where I overcomplicated what I wanted, and then it made the tool so that we ended up not using the piece that I overcomplicated or on the back end months down after implementation, it broke for whatever reason. Because I wanted it a certain way and they're like, well, that's complicated to build it that way. Horror stories have been where after implementation for whatever reason, someone deletes data. That's always a scary thing when you spent a lot of time loading data a certain way or getting it in a certain format, and for whatever reason, someone mistakenly pushes the wrong button. So that's where I learned, with some of the tools, you can lock things down at certain periods so that people can't edit. That's the beauty of some of these tools is you have these versions or permissions.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: When you're telling that horror story of data being deleted, I still remember we had received this template from corporate that were supposed to use for our plan, and it was built in such a way that you could just override everything that was in there. So we wrote we loaded just certain line items within different countries' panels because that's what we manage. So it happened is they'd go in and overwrite them all the time. So we had to figure out how to lock them and got to the point where my boss had a file every night, where he would download everything to see what our numbers were at the end of the day, and then compare it the next morning to figure out who had changed numbers. It was a nightmare because things weren't locked properly. So I'm with you on that. You have to make sure you protect the data in the right way. Otherwise, it just becomes a nightmare. So next couple questions I want to ask you a little bit about private equity, because I know you've spent a lot of time with private equity. So what do PE companies from your experience expect from FP&A teams? How can FP&A teams make sure they're meeting the needs of the private equity investors?

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: It always depends. Your very first question was, what does a great FP&A team look like? When you're in an organization where FP&A is a core mission-critical group, the private equity group will expect and look to FP&A as the source of truth. I've seen it time and time again where the salespeople will present data, they'll present numbers, and they'll just say, look, thank you. We want to get this from the FP&A group. We want to know what the finance team is saying because that is the source of truth for them. That's usually when we become the source of truth for all things analysis, forecasting, and budgeting and you're thinking of investing in a new vertical of any kind or a new product, FP&A is the one who will lead it out. Then the PE groups expect that.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: To me, that makes a lot of sense. Because, one, finance is cross-functional. If you're defining CAC and you ask the salesperson or the marketing, they may define it one way. You go over to somebody else, they'll define it in a different way. Finance has a third one. Finance usually has the least incentive to manipulate the number. I don't want to say that in a negative way, but calculate it in a way that makes them look good. So I agree with you. It's used to have that independent voice with both the operational and the financial metrics. It goes so much beyond just the PNL, as you mentioned. They look to you as a source of truth. So I'd like to see that continue and see more of that because I think finance is perfectly positioned for that. The next question I have is, when you talk about PE and what they expect, what are the types of reports that you typically see that maybe PE is focused on that you wouldn't necessarily see in a non-PE company, or how are they different in that area?

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: It depends. There are a lot of contingencies on this. I've worked at various stages of, the size of companies or even where they're at their maturity of investment or even the intent of how they're growing. But the more mature ones, they have a very robust, what I'll call monthly reporting package that is lengthy, you could have a spreadsheet that has several 100 tabs on it because they want intimate details of PNLs, geography PNLs, product PNLs, or even segment PNLs. The sizing or how you group that can happen. What's interesting is they'll ask for those levels of detail. Often you don't have it. You don't know how to get it. You don't know how to present it, but they'll ask for it, and then you'll start presenting it and they'll stop asking the question, saying, well, we're not sure that CAC and this makes sense. Do the analysis on it. Then you do it and they're like, okay, we like it. That's pretty common. They're always asking to maybe look at something different or in a different light, as you're thinking about forecasting, they want to see different versions of forecasting. Something I have seen, Paul, is they all want to see it in PowerPoint, they all want to see a PDF of your monthly reporting. I've seen where people try to enable them to look at like a dashboard somewhere. They don't want to see a dashboard, they want it in a PowerPoint, easily presentable that way.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: Good to know on that one. I appreciate you sharing a little bit more there and how it's different. But I know from my experience, we're a pretty large, mature company when we're taking PE, and when they started rolling out all their month-end decks, they wanted a ton of information. So I know what you're talking about. Also, once you're able to get them comfortable, if you're growing, you're hitting your numbers there. I've found they're much less likely to dig. But if you're struggling with your numbers, they're all over you.

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: They'll show up. They'll come physically into the office and start talking to you when things don't look as good.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: The best advice is, give them what they want, hit your numbers and it will go smoother. If it was only that simple all the time.

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: If only.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: I'm curious, what advice would you offer to someone listening who maybe just had their firm acquired by a PE company? How do you manage that transition? Because I know it's a scary one for a lot of people.

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: I'd first say, just get ready to learn. These are some of the brightest minds. They come with years and years of experience. Typically, in my experiences, I worked with private equity groups that spent decades investing in software companies. They live it, they breathe it, they know what great looks like and they know how to analyze it. They will come with a thesis of why they acquired that business, whether it's rethinking your pricing strategy or a new product to develop, they'll come with a thesis around M&A like, hey, you have all these products, but your your competitors have these ones. Let's go acquire some of them. They'll also come up with ideas on how to win against the competition. Guess what? All of that requires data analysis. That requires the finance team to get ready to do analyses. You've never done or to rethink how you're presenting data. My advice always is to be responsive to them and manage their expectations. You can't say no to something. You're allowed to say, we will get to that, but let us get to you next month. Sometimes we're too excited. We're like, yes, we'll give that to you all today. All of a sudden you got a team that's completely burned out because they spent so much time redoing their reporting package. But they are also very willing and listening to how you operate, and they can respect that.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: I agree, they do respect that. I can still remember one experience where they asked for all kinds of data. I looked at them. I said it's not doable. Systems don't allow that today. We don't have it. We'll start working on it. It took me about a month. It was just understanding our product margins because this was a company that just had done a ton of acquisitions and so had a lot of outdated systems that had never been integrated. It was just the descriptions were all wrong. So it's like, okay, which product is this related to for this bill? It took months and it was still funny. I showed it to the product people and they're like, we've been asking this for years. We've never even seen this. It was probably 80% right, directionally, correct. But it was the best we could do. They appreciated it and it helped us. Hey there. It's your host, the FP&A guy. Today, I'm thrilled to talk to you about Plan Buddies, where professionals meet excellence. This isn't just any community. It is a community run by and for planning professionals. Our plan buddies were all about fostering connections, sharing knowledge, and providing mentorship among FP&A experts. Ready to elevate your career? Visit plan-buddies.com and become a member today. Here's a special treat. Use the promo code TheFPandAGuy, which is TheFPandAGuy for an exclusive 25% discount on your first-year membership.

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: You've described a scenario that's very common where they do these acquisitions, they mash them together, they have different systems, different data. It's hard to put it all together and present it, but they'll want it. Then the people, just as you described it, the product people like, this is amazing. Why do we have this? It's like, well, this is hard to do.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: I'm speaking to the choir in the sense that you've seen that more than once. So we're going to move into what's called a rapid-fire section. I have five questions for you. You get no more than 15 seconds to answer the question. Then at the end, if you wanted to elaborate on one of the 1 or 2 of the questions, you can go ahead and elaborate. So we're looking for just kind of short, quick answers here. What is your favorite thing about Excel?

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: Power Pivot.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: I love Power Pivot. Have not had that answer before, I like it.  What's your least favorite thing about Excel?

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: It still doesn't do well with large files, complex formulas, and trying to share it with people. It just gets clunky. That's what I don't like about it.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: I can relate to that one. I think a lot of people feel your pain there. Are you currently using generative AI?

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: Minimally, I use ChatGPT probably once or twice a week to ask fun questions, and sometimes I put things about work in there.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: Got it. What is the number one technical skill that FP&A professionals should master?

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: I think the ability to create a clean financial model. I'm talking about a clean financial model, not overly complicated, no copy and pasting values like formulas.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: I hear you, a clean, well-designed model that follows some best practice principles versus you get the model with hard codes everywhere and inputs all over the place. You're like, where do I start? This thing is a total mess.

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: Exactly.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: So I hear you. What's the number one soft skill for FP&A professionals?

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: I have two, but I'll give you my number one.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: You can do two. Go ahead. I'll let you.

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: The first one is dealing with ambiguity. Especially, when you're working with senior leaders, they constantly, vaguely describe things. You, as a professional, need to understand what that means. Guess what? That takes experience and time and you don't just figure that out in one day. That's hard to do. The second one that I want to highlight is that anyone can do is just showing urgency and being responsive. Someone emails you, hey, what's going on with this thing? Send them a note, write back. Anyone could do that one. The first one, dealing with ambiguity, I think, takes maturity and time.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: I would agree. I'm going to add one thought when you said responding back quickly. I still remember I had joined a new team. I'd come to learn that a reputation for not being responsive. I think one of the VPs had told me that. About six months in, I remember I was in a meeting with him and just one other person. He made a comment about how the team wasn't very responsive, but he immediately turned to me. He's like the present company excluded. Because I had made it a point to respond quickly, especially, since I had been told that's an issue from this team. So I made a point of saying, I'm going to make sure I do that. people notice when you're responsive and you show that initiative, it will be recognized.

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: They value it. They're like, wow, this he cares. This person cares about what's going on. Anyone can do that. That is not a secret skill. It's easy.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: FP&A Guy here, and I want you to join me this October in New York City. There is going to be the Finance and Accounting Technology Expo. Connect, explore, expand. This is going to be all about technology for the Office of Finance. This is an event you do not want to miss. Be there with me in New York City and listen to industry experts share their thoughts about technology and finance, and see the latest tools out there that can make your lives easier. This event is from October 28th to October 30th. If you want to go ahead and register for this event, go to strategiccfo360.com/fate. That's strategiccfo360.com/fate. Use the code ASY 469. That is ASY 469 to register for free. If you do that in the next few weeks, you'll be able to join me in New York at no cost. See you there! I 100% agree. So this next section is our Get to Know You section. We have four questions for you here where we get to know you a little bit better. So tell me about a favorite hobby or passion you have. I don't know.

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: I don't know if this dates me or makes me sound old, even though I'm not that old. I love to garden. I love planting trees and flowers. We have a nice-sized property here. I love it. Me and my wife, we're always out in our yard all summer long.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: What's the favorite thing you like to plant? Do you have a vegetable or fruit tree? Something you like?

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: I love some of my trees. I have a zelkova tree that I love. A Norway maple, those are just beautiful trees. I do love my peach tree. When it's peach season, we have almost daily fresh peach shakes, which is amazing.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: I have a peach tree. I love it as well. So I hear you on that one. What is one book you can recommend to our audience that they should read?

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: I'm going to cheat again. I'm going to give you two. The first one is an older book and it's weird to say that this book is almost 100 years old now. It's the book by Dale Carnegie, How to Win Friends and Influence People.

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: I knew you were going to say that when you said 100 years old. I have it right back here.

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: I have it somewhere over here. It's one of my favorites. I listened to it and read it every year, but the other one that I think is more recent, which I think is also very relevant, is a book by Clayton Christensen called How Will You Measure Your Life? He passed away in the last couple of years.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: Harvard professor, right?

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: Influential Consultant, great book. If anyone's trying to think about what they want to do in their careers, read that book. I think it'll help you.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: Great. I appreciate that. The next question is, favorite travel destination, if you can go anywhere in the world tomorrow, where are you going?

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: I love warm beaches. I'd probably say, Maui or Kauai. I like the Hawaiian Islands.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: The last one is here. If you could have dinner with one person alive in the world today, who are you going to dinner with?

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: I don't have an answer for this, Paul. My experience has been, that every time I sit down with a business owner or somebody who has this great experience, I love to pick their brain and ask them questions of what made them successful. So maybe a Warren Buffett. Maybe that's my answer. Someone like that where they just have a long list of experience and then I could learn from.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: Well, I'm going to be on the fly on the wall for your Warren Buffett dinner. Well, thank you so much for joining us. I've enjoyed chatting with you here, Trevor. We have a final question here before we let you go, what advice would you offer to our audience to be a better business partner?

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: I think in addition to the soft skills that I mentioned, like being responsive, the one that, and again, this is another simple one that anyone could do is listen and take notes and follow up. I've seen time and time again that I'm sitting in a meeting with people and they're not taking notes, and they're asking them important things. There's an important follow-up. Just take notes and then email them back. These are the notes I captured. This is the follow-up. I'm going to do this by the end of the week. Simple but it's like amazing when anyone does that. You're like, wow, these guys care. So I'd say the other one is incentives. Paul, you mentioned and we don't have that data. Instead of starting with no, start with yes, and find ways to solve someone's problem. We're so quick to say, oh, we can't do that. It's impossible to take too much time. Start with a yes, and try to figure out how you can get that data or how you can present it.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: I 100% agree. It's a change in mindset if you're always starting with that yes. One of my friends always says I haven't done that yet, which is the mindset change. When someone says, oh, I could never be good at that. He'll say, you're not good at it yet, just to make them think that I can learn how to do that. So I think that's about mindset and it makes a huge difference. It's not, as you said, something that requires experience, requires effort.

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: That's right.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: Thank you so much for joining us. We'll put your LinkedIn profile in the show notes if anyone wants to contact you. But I enjoyed chatting with you today, Trevor. Just learning a little bit about your experience and wish you the best of luck in your current role and your career as you go forward. Thanks again for joining us.

 

Guest: Trevor Anthony:: Thanks, Paul. It's been great.

 

Host: Paul Barnhurst:: Thanks for listening to FP&A Tomorrow. If you enjoyed the show, please leave us a five-star rating and a review on your podcast platform of choice. This allows us to continue to bring you great guests from around the globe. As a reminder, you can earn CPE credit by going to earmarkcpe.com, downloading the app, taking a short quiz, and getting your CPE certificate. To earn continuing education credits for the FPAC certification, take the quiz on earmark and contact me the show host for further details.



Ankita Ghosh
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